Swimming news – 100 breaststroke NAG Record reported by Braden Keith
14-year old pro swimmer Michael Andrew has re-broken his own National Age Group Record in the 100 yard breaststroke, swimming a 53.88 to win the 14 & under division at the 2014 NASA Junior National Cup. Andrew split 25.07/28.81 in the race, which clears the 54.04 that he did at the Jenks Sectional on March 7th.
Andrew became the firs 13-14 to go under 56 seconds, then the first to go under 55 seconds, and he’s now the first to go under 54 seconds in this event, which shows just how far he (and Reece Whitley) have taken this record in the last year.
Andrew now holds the 6 fastest times in this event in the history of the age group, and is 1.8 seconds clear of Reece Whitley’s second-ranked 55.61.
He wasn’t the fastest swimmer overall at this meet in the event, Texas-bound high school senior Austin Temple was a 52.87 in the 16 & up division. That time is within a tenth of what Texas’ breaststroker split on their 400 medley relay at NCAA’s on Thursday.
Psychodad,
Please correct me anywhere I’m wrong here:
1) Salo/Soni destroyed breaststroke
2) Phelps/Bowman destroyed butterfly
3) Janet Evans destroyed freestyle
4) Berkoff destroyed backstroke (Eddie Reese and Peirsol later saved it, but oh wait, Peirsol set his first WR’s under Salo??)
5) Don Schwartz destroyed training (why would we want to do periodization, let’s just swim as many yards as possible all the time)
Did I get those things correct?
I think so.
“Salo destroying breaststroke” is a Hyperbole and should be understood that way. It is meant to mean “Salo style of breaststroke.”
Now, let’s review the state of USA swimming. USA is doing very good in freestyle and backstroke, but not near as good in butterfly and breaststroke. Why? because of two dominant teachings in past decade: Bowman’s fly and Salo’s breaststroke, and everyone following them. They developed style they believed is best for their top athletes (Phelps and Soni). Does not work for 99% of others. Why is everything trying to copy it? That is what bothers me.
Now, I expect more name calling and stupid knee jerk reactions instead of intelligent discussion, not very often found here.
Hey, I agree that we should use intellegent discussion here, so how about you respond to my post above regarding butterfly? I feel I was very reasonable and used examples that include the best swimmers in the world at the biggest meet in the world. If it doesn’t work for 99% of the other swimmers, how did they make it to an Olympic final doing it? As underwaters get longer and top speed gets closer to the theoretical max, the only way to get faster is to get more oxygen the first half so you can extend that speed for longer.
If you’re suggesting that the majority of elite butterfliers in the world made the finals of the 100… Read more »
To further illustrate my point, looking at the men’s 100 fly splits, not only was every medalist breathing every stroke, but you can see why in the splits.
Every stroke:
Phelps 2.51s spread between first and second 50
Le Clos 2.54s
Korotyshkin 3.28s
McGill 3.54s
Average spread of 2.97s, average place of 2.75 (counting the tie for second, which is offset below by the tie for fourth)
other breathing pattern (generally 1 up, 1 down or 2 up, 1 down):
Cavic 4.67s
Diebler 4.21s
Verlinden 3.24s
Czerniak 4.23s
Average spread of 4.09s, average place of 5.5
Sven, you are clouding the argument with facts. Cut it out.
Listen, it can all be resolved very simply, by asking yourself this one little question:
Is that how The Greatest Coach Who Ever Has Or Ever Will Grace A Pool Deck Eddie Reese would teach it? If the answer is no, then it is wrong. Period.
(Wow, I feel really bad about dragging Eddie- who I really, really like into this… but @psychoswimdad ‘s infatuation with him is too funny).
Consider me smashed. It’s like Thor lent the great hammer Mjolnir to his angry green friend 🙁
I’m also a big fan of Eddie Reese, he gave us some of the greatest stroke swimmers of the 2000’s in Hansen, Piersol, and Crocker (plus many more). The man has gotten results, no doubt. As a former flyer, I have to say Ian Crocker is one of my favorite swimmers, since for a while he was one of the only swimmers who could beat Phelps in one of his specialty races.
And so, I concede defeat. I will pack up my real world examples with my knowledge of stroke mechanics and trudge home in shame, and from this day forth I solemnly… Read more »
Rafael – substantiate your claims or go away. Do you have ANY proof. ANYTHING at all. No…no you don’t.
P.s. this is about psycho dad – don’t go down this rode…
I never commented on Salo graduate swimmers doping or blaming him for that. I do not blame him for “destroying USA breaststroke” either. I blame everyone else for blindly following his teachings without using thinking.
I never said that was his fault.. but the dopers were His swimmers under his tutelage.. If he was a coach FROM any other country I doubt you would react like that.. as if doing a investigation was something awful..
Yes, .0001 percent of Salo’s swimmers have failed a drug test with ZERO implications, evidence or rumbling…. call the cops…get the crime lab involved….
come on dude…..
I do not like Psycho Dad. He is arrogent, a name caller, is dismissive about one of the the most successful coaches in american history (Salo), he part time coaches his kids and rips on his own kids programs. It just isn’t fun reading him. This is my opinion…
An above poster did point out he isn’t anonymous – even I know his name and what club he swims for…it makes me wonder if his club is thrilled about him posting how he has to personally clean up his kids bad habits. Would they like hearing that? It seems disrespectful to the coaches that put in so many hours to make his kids better and/or makes him look foolish for… Read more »
One of the most sucessful coaches and probably the guy who more swimmers under his tutelage got in doping problems and I wonder why no one ever tried to make a in depth check of WHY so many dopers with Salo..
Psychodad,
Maybe if you took a less dismissive tone (namely statements like “Salo is destroying breaststroke) you wouldn’t catch so much grief. I heard that in your neck of the woods there is a saying “there’s more than one way to skin a cat”. Breaststroke is similar. You make it sound like first place is awarded on how high someone can get out of the water and how pretty their stroke looks. Last I checked, the clock determines first place.
As a swim historian, I’m sure you’ll recall how bad people were dissing phelps and bowman for breathing every stroke in the fly and that seemed to work out quite well. Let’s just wait and see what Cordes/Andrew end… Read more »
Fair comments. Appreciate it (BTW, I am not here to make friends – I express my opinion without attacking anyone personally – except Salo 🙂 – and I am having fun doing it. Back to topic, how do you explain lack of breaststroke success of (young) USA swimmers on the international scene recently? I am also a USA swimming official and I watch endless stream of young girls trying to copy (unsuccessfully) Soni’s style. Clubs teach “look in front of you – stay low” breaststroke style, which again in my opinion is totally wrong. This is all result of Salo’s teaching and Soni’s success, which will not be repeated any time soon.
>As a swim historian, I’m sure you’ll recall… Read more »
Breathing every stroke on the fly is something that only works for Phelps?
In London, 4 out of the 8 swimmers in the mens 100 fly final breathed every stroke. Three of those four filled up the podium. Michael Andrew, the fastest 14 year old flyer so far in American history, breathes every stroke. This is not a passing trend.
In the 200 fly in London, 7 of 8 swimmers in the men’s 200 fly final breathed every stroke.
From personal experience, I can say that if you learn the technique (bigger second kick, press chin forward, let head rise with shoulders instead of forcing the breath early), it’s just as fast while allowing more oxygen. Yes, Phelps is a… Read more »
I just want someone to name ONE top level breaststroker in last 20 years that swam and won swimming low, the way Michael and Kevin Cordes do. Name just one! There is a reason that nobody at the international level swims that way. In USA, it is a “Soni effect” – Salo is destroying breaststroke in the USA with “stay low” crusade that everyone is so blindly following.
[Braden, this post is worth another 50 angry posts by “small penis” crowd of cartoon heros. and how do you repay me: by unfollowing me on the twitter. Nice touch].
Roman Sloudnov
Leisel Jones
Penny Heyns – won both breaststrokes at 1996 Olympics – undulated but quite low.
Am I nuts or did you actually name a fairly successful breaststroker in your post?
Don’t worry psychodad… I still follow you on twitter.
I would miss you if you don’t anymore :). I posted my backstroke presentation few weeks ago – no attacks from you on that? I was expecting a bloodshed. I hope you incorporated all my “teachings” in your everyday practice. Love.
I must have been at a meet and missed it. Shucks.
Scroll down my tweets and you can find the link to download the file. Your (backstroke) life will never be the same 🙂
Sorry. I actually did go looking for it. But after reading your March 20th tweets I lost interest in anything you had to say.
What? My tweet/return in support of Down Syndrome day made you “lost interest in anything you had to say”. What am I missing?
March 20. March 21. Same thing, I guess.
Classy Psycho Dad…very classy….
PsychoDad, what is your twitter name? I am curious to see what you tweet…..
@psychoswimdad
Thanks Hulk.
sorry but Kevin Cordes is a very good breaststroker. And he doesn’t even stay low in the water really. He is a definite contender the the gold medal in Rio, maybe not the favorite but a contender.
Does anybody have a record of what Gyurta was going in the breaststrokes from the age of 12 on??? Am very curious to see how MA stacks up to his old times. Please someone answer 🙂
Gyurta at 14 was 1:02.39/2:13.63
at 15 was 2:10.80
at 16 was 2:10.75
That’s all I have
Psychodad is back!
Even if he hasn’t always been very nice with me, I’m happy to see he’s still alive. 😆
Bobo, you have a list or remember who posted of who was the fastest 14 year old ever? Remember lot of times from Hagino.
I have a 14 years list that I think is accurate (I have a top 10 for each of these that is less accurate)
50 Free 22.73 Lim
100 Free 50.86 Chalmers
200 Free 1:50.07 Thorpe
400 Free 3:49.64 Thorpe
800 Free 8:08.75 Pinion (suit), probably Jesse Vassallo split without a suit
1500 Free 15:31.03 Vassallo
100 Back 56.25 Hagino
200 Back 1:59.26 Hagino
100 Breast 1:02.39 Gyurta
200 Breast 2:13.63 Gyurta
100 Fly 53.18 Kobori
200 Fly 1:59.02 Phelps
200 IM 2:03.71 Hagino
400 IM 4:21.85 Hagino
Great stuff!
Thanks for the hard work!
So Michael Andrew does not have even one of fastest swims for 14 yo.
I wonder if he will do it in the 15 yo, which will be even harder when that is the age when Thorpe, Phelps, Gyurta became world champions or Olympics medalist and Hagino and Irie really shot up.
I think hard..
Gyurta 200 Br, Thorpe 200/400 free and Phelps 200 Fly are probably unbeatable for a long long time.. the other must be pretty hard too
But I mean, he’s gotta be close-ish in most, no? His range is by far his most outstanding quality at this point.
Awesome… and why can’t FINA do this for the 18s? If (no offense) Scuba Steve can dig out 14 and unders… why can’t FINA figure out the 18 and unders?
I posted the 18 and unders somewhere else (here) last week if you’re interested Hulk
Sorry, I missed some times. So Michael Andrew isn’t the fastest in the world in any LCM event for his age. Still pretty good. He’s the fastest in the US in many SCY events but that may be misleading due to the fact that Hagino, Gyurta, Thorpe didn’t swim yards and even Michael Phelps never swam yards seriously.
It takes better technique to be the best in LCM. Even the fastest college swimmers don’t always have the best technique.
True, the above water swimming has to be a lot better to excel in long course. It’s a good sign for MA, then, as his DPS on most strokes is great and most people would agree his underwaters are his weakness.
Part of it is birth dates. He ages up before the major long course season in the US so he would have had to make much of his 13-14 times as a 13 year old – pretty tough to do.
Bobo. Mon Cheri,
When “I was not very nice to you” it has always been a joke, result of me “hating French people.” You should have understood that as a joke – I noted that several times.
No reason for you to hate us.
And no reason for us to hate you.
We have saved you with La Fayette against the English invasion in the 1770s and the 1780s.
You have saved us against the Nazi invasion in the World War II.
Serbia didn’t save France from the Nazi’s….
Well, we asked but they said “Nope, thanks, no need, we are good.” So….
Bobo, Mon petit cheri,
Again, misunderstanding… “Hating all French People” is a joke – I do not hate French people – I even ate french fries when Americans started calling then “Freedom Fries” (yeah, I know, Americans are dumb sometimes). I posted once that I hate French people same way Stephen Colbert hates bears, but I guess that joke was lost on your – local one I understand. Sorry.