Best Junior Times Ever: An Open Source Record Book

  61 Braden Keith | May 21st, 2014 | Featured, International, National, News

pinit fg en rect gray 28 Best Junior Times Ever: An Open Source Record Book

With the April 1st “open season” on the new FINA Junior World Records, there’s very much of a limbo-situation left in the gap between the recognized Junior World Record, and the fastest times ever done by a junior.

And so, below, we’ve made our best attempt at assembling these “Junior World bests,” sticking with FINA’s definition of a ‘junior.” That is to say, girls who are aged 14-17 or boys who are aged 15-18, based on their age on December 31st.

That eliminates some really good, really well-known swims, like Thorpe’s World Record at 18, but in the year he turned 19.

This is where we’re asking for help from our readers. We know we have great readers that know a lot about swimming, and because of the monumental task of tracking down these “bests,” we fully recognize that there’s some we might have missed.

And so, before we settle up with these as Junior World bests, we’re reaching out to our audience to help make sure we haven’t overlooked any. Some were easy to figure out, especially on the girls’ side, where a huge portion of the current World Records were done by swimmers 17 & under.

If you think you’ve found a time that should replace one on this list, leave it in the comments with time, meet, and results if you can find them, and if we can verify, we’ll update the list.

Once suggestions quiet down for a few days, we’ll settle things up (they can always be changed later if one happens to have still been overlooked).

Interestingly, thus far, only two (UPDATED) of these swims is also the Junior World Record – that’s Evgeny Sedov’s 50 fly and Santana’s 100 free.

50 Free 21.98 Evgeny Sedov
100 Free 48.35 Matheus Santana* (McEvoy was 48.0 as an 18-year old, but in his “19th year”)
200 Free 1:43.90 Danila Izotov (still his best time)
400 Free 3:40.59 Ian Thorpe (his 3:40.17 was done at 18, but was in his “19th year”)
800 Free 7:45.67 Mack Horton (Really hard to find this one – Thorpe’s WR wasn’t until his “19th year”)
1500 Free 14:46.84 Sun Yang (14:43.48 from Kieren Perkins was in his “19th year”, UPDATED)
50 Back 25.04 Ryan Murphy (Xu Jiayu in his 19th year)
100 Back 53.38 Ryan Murphy (Hagino in 19th year)
200 Back 1:54.77 Ryosuke Irie (Hagino in 19th year, Peirsol in 19th year, UPDATED)
50 Breast 27.16 (Johannes Skagius)
100 Breast 59.56 Akahiro Yamaguchi (UPDATED)
200 Breast 2:07.01 Akahiro Yamaguchi
50 Fly 23.28 Evgeny Sedov*
100 Fly 51.10 Michael Phelps
200 Fly 1:53.93 Michael Phelps
200 IM 1:55.94 Michael Phelps (UPDATED – Hagino was in his 19th year)
400 IM 4:08.94 Kosuke Hagino (UPDATED)

50 Free 23.99 Cate Campbell
100 Free 53.03 Cate Campbell
200 Free 1:55.06 Missy Franklin
400 Free 3:59.82 Katie Ledecky
800 Free 8:13.86 Katie Ledecky
1500 Free 15:36.54 Katie Ledecky
50 Back 27.22 Fu Yuanhui (UPDATED)
100 Back 58.33 Missy Franklin
200 Back 2:04.06 Missy Franklin
50 Breast 29.48 Ruta Meilutyte
100 Breast 1:04.35 Ruta Meilutyte
200 Breast 2:22.78 Keiko Fukudome (Watanabe faster in 18th year, UPDATED)
50 Fly 25.66 Sarah Sjostrom (done in both 2009 and 2010)
100 Fly 56.06 Sarah Sjostrom
200 Fly 2:04.72 Jiao Liuyang (Jiao Liuyang and Ellen Gandy were faster in their 18th year, while 17)
200 IM 2:07.57 Ye Shiwen
400 IM 4:28.43 Ye Shiwen

Comments

  1. jd14 says:
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    The Chinese guy, Jiayu Xu, went 52.3 in the hundred back a couple days ago, and was still eighteen I believe..

  2. ILove2Swim says:
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    Girl’s 200 breast???

  3. Majer99 says:
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    McEvoys 100 free was in his 19th year

  4. The Beach says:
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    Women’s 200 breast?

  5. carlo says:
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    xu jiayu is probably the first backstroker that is really good over 50,100 and 200 meters.i think ryosuke irie has the best backstroke technique with very little splashing of water.xu jiayu will have to improve over 200 meters to become a great multi distance backstroker. xu jiayu,s time of 1:55:11 in in 200 meters backstroke is not too bad but he has to improve. his 50 and 100 meters times are really top notch.katie ledeky has some serious muscle,she has a lot more muscle than her competitors. lotte frills and belmonte garcia dont have her muscle mass,especially belmonte garcia.i was looking at a picture of belmonte garcia a while back and she doesn,t even look like an elite athlete yet with little or no muscle and on top of that she,s just 5,7 in height.she doesn,t even look like an athlete and yet she swims in multiple events like the 400 free,800 free,1500 free,the individual medleys and the 200 butterfly.ye shiwen has little muscle too.

    • PsychoDad says:
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      >i think ryosuke irie has the best backstroke technique with very little splashing of water

      This type of comments about Irie drive me crazy every time I read them. People repeat this senselessly over and over. He does not have best backstroke technique. he has A technique that you like because it is so “pretty.” Why is it so bad to “splash water?” Because of his nice and pretty entry that you like so much, he will always be a bridesmaid and never a bride.

      • coacherik says:
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        ^^^^^^^ Never fails to deliver.

      • aswimfan says:
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        With his technique, if only Irie were as big and tall as Grevers and Clary, he’d have destroyed WRs.

        • Rafael says:
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          If Irie had at least 1.90 both WR were toast

          • PsychoDad says:
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            >With his technique, if only Irie were as big and tall as Grevers and Clary, he’d have destroyed WRs.

            I expected better from you then this nonsense. It does not work that way. If..if..if… whatever…

        • Philip Johnson says:
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          Technique isn’t everything and doesn’t guarantee success, and I do agree with PSYCHODAD on the point that we shouldn’t live in a world of “what ifs.” Evans had terrible technique and was small, but broke world records and trounced her larger and more technique conscious competitors. Haile Gebrselassie, one of the best distance runners of all-time, didn’t have ideal running technique. Soni is often criticized of her techinique. Could better technique have made these competitors better? That’s impossible to answer for all we know if could have made them worse.

          • aswimfan says:
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            In long axis strokes (ie. crawl and back), especially in sprint being tall is a huge asset.

            Can anyone please remind me of a male freestyle or backstroke world champion/olympic champion/world record holder (shiny suit does not count) in recent years who is nearly as short as Irie?

            Soni swam short axis stroke.

            Evans swam distance events, and her 200 was no where nearly as good as her 400 in quality.

            Anyone else?

      • SprintDude9000 says:
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        Psychodad – Splashing water is bad because it increases wave drag. To improve efficiency swimmers should aim to displace as little water as possible.

        • PsychoDad says:
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          >Splashing water is bad because it increases wave drag

          Yes, if you splash it like 2 year olds. You read this somewhere like the poster heard from announcers calling Irie a “technician.” I believe in old saying: “In backstroke, if they cannot hear your stroke, you are not doing it right.” You have to drive your arm into the water for fast catch and pull and fast arm turnover.

          • SprintDude9000 says:
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            >You read this somewhere like the poster heard from announcers calling Irie a “technician.”

            Nope – I was taught the importance of this by a coach with a physics PHD.

            >”I believe in old saying: “In backstroke, if they cannot hear your stroke, you are not doing it right.” You have to drive your arm into the water for fast catch and pull and fast arm turnover.”

            What’s to prevent you doing all that whilst minimizing splashing?

      • Yu says:
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        Also, If youre splashing water, youre also probably pushing water in the wrong direction..

  6. HKSWIMMER says:
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    For Women’s 50m back – Lau Shiu Yue is incorrect. Firstly, I doubt that’s the correct time; secondly Lau is a he, holding the Men’s 50 back Short Course record in Hong Kong with a time of 25.06.

  7. PAC12BACKER says:
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    Mary T. Meagher still has a record after all these decades? Incredible!!!

  8. mcgillrocks says:
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    Hagino turns 20 this year, making 2014 his “20th year.” By that logic 2013 was his 19th, so his records from last year don’t count. Given 2004 was Phelps’ 19th year, I think Hagino might hold the record in the 400 IM from London, where he went 4:08.94, just faster than Phelps 2003 time.

    Of course, as long as we’re compiling unofficial records, couldn’t we also list the fastest ever times by an 18 year old, regardless of birthday timing?

  9. Flyin' says:
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    Yeah, McEvoy’s 48.07 was in 2013, his 19th year, which I think puts Santana as the fastest, from just a couple weeks ago.

  10. Majer99 says:
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    Irie 200 back 1:54.77 japan open June 2008 born 1990 so 18th year

  11. Rafael says:
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    Yang is from 1991, at 2008 he went 14:48:39 and in 2009 he went 14:46:84.. So the 1500 record is his

  12. Rafael says:
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    Yang times were at 2008 OG and 2009 Worlds (Forget to add this)

  13. Majer99 says:
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    Possible women’s 200 breast keiko Fukudome 2:22.78 japan junior cup 29 August 2009

    • Braden Keith Braden Keith says:
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      Majer99 – It looks like she’s a ’93 birth, so looks like Fukudome is a new leader in the women’s 200 breaststroke.

    • Rafael says:
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      When will Ukranian National happen? Probably Solnceva will crush the 200m mark.. she went 2:23:12 last year and she will turn 16 this year..

  14. Majer99 says:
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    Jiao 200 fly 2008 Olympics 2:04.72 listed as born 91

  15. Rafael says:
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    Braden, at 18 years old, on the year turning 19 the 1500 time is Sun Yang 14:35:43 at 2010 Asian Games, the time was at November, he was born on December.

    • Braden Keith Braden Keith says:
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      Rafael – that wouldn’t have qualified had FINA been accepting Junior WR then, because he was 19 on December 31. For the purposes of this list, we’re trying to hold true to FINA’s age ranges. We can definitely do a different list based on “true age” swims next, though.

      Ultimately, some people have an advantage if you look at age on December 31, and the opposite group has the advantage if you base age on birthday.

      • aswimfan says:
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        Why would the opposite group has the advantage if you base it on birthday?

        Birthday is birthday, and turning 19 yo is the same for every group.

  16. Sven says:
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    Ever since FINA decided to observe junior WR’s, I wondered what the reasoning was for the girls being 14-17 and boys being 15-18. Why the disparity?

    • Braden Keith Braden Keith says:
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      Sven – it’s the same age ranges as the Junior World Championships. That’s probably the root of the rationale.

    • Sven says:
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      I’m guessing it accounts for the different rates of maturity, but is that the official rationale?

      • Braden Keith Braden Keith says:
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        Yeah, if you took it a step further, that’s probably where you’d drill down to. Meet qualifying ages are commonly done this way around the world; some countries also do their age records this way.

  17. Wirotomo says:
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    Braden, could you also make the best textile list?
    I think it’s shiny suit’s time for men 200m free and 1500m free & women 50m free, 100m free, 200m breast, 100m fly, and 200m fly. Can we get the real junior best time on that events without help from that super suit? :-)

    • Braden Keith Braden Keith says:
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      A textile list in this case can be a bit dicey and misleading. Whereas all great swimmers had some period of their peak outside of the “shiny suit” era, for those who were 17 and 18 and 2008 and 2009, they will have had no ‘unaided’ opportunity to get onto the list, know what I mean?

      • Wirotomo says:
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        yeah i know what you mean.
        i think I’m just sentimental. because of that shiny suit, Thorpe’s
        1:45.37 (200 free), Paltrinieri 14:48.92 (1500 free), and Hagino’s 1:55.74 (200 back) can’t make the list. :-)

      • aswimfan says:
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        I agree that it is quite dicey.

        For example, I absolutely don’t think Izotov would have been anywhere close to that 1:43.90 had he not been in x-glide. Izotov’s textile PB is 1:45.59 in Barcelona last year.

        On the other hand, swimmers like Campbell or Sjoestrom would still have broken/held the records (albeit slower) had they been in textile in 2009.
        Campbell swam 24.89 as 14 yo in textile, and then she also swam 24.48 in textile in 2007, barely turned 15 yo.

        • Rafael says:
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          Same for Sun, he swan 14:35 textile before turning 19 on 2010.. he could have gone 14:46 even without the suits at 2009..

  18. theroboticrichardsimmons says:
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    Open question to group – since we’re already taking liberties with the FINA rules, why are we sticking with the requirement to anchor a swimmers age to their December 31st birthday? It’s an arbitrary and silly constraint that unfairly penalizes swimmers whose birthdays are later in the year.

    If we truly want a *real* Junior World Record Book, I propose that we simply count all swims done by males prior to their 19th birthday and females prior to their 18th birthday. Doing anything other than that is capricious, lazy, or both.

    • Wirotomo says:
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      50m Free Evgeny Sedov Russia 96 21.98 31-Mar-14 Russian Cup Rostov, RUS
      100m Free Cameron McEvoy Australia 13-May-94 48.07 30-Apr-13 Australia National Championships Adelaide, AUS
      It’s not lazy theroboticrichardsimmons, I think swimswam just want to make “what-might-have-been” list if FINA want to accept the records in the past, with the rule they set for their official records.
      And the rule is not that bad, IAAF use the same 31 Dec cut-off for their junior world record.
      But if you want the real record, i think we can make that list.

      I’m searching for awhile and I come up with this list for men (maybe someday i have the time to search the women record) :-):

      50m Free Evgeny Sedov Russia 96 21.98 31-Mar-14 Russian Cup Rostov, RUS
      100m Free Cameron McEvoy Australia 13-May-94 48.07 30-Apr-13 Australia National Championships Adelaide, AUS
      200m Free Danila Izotov Russia 2-Oct-91 1.43.90 28-Jul-09 World Championships Rome, ITA
      400m Free Ian Thorpe Australia 13-Oct-82 3.40.17 22-Jul-01 World Championships Fukuoka, JPN
      800m Free Ian Thorpe Australia 13-Oct-82 7.39.16 24-Jul-01 World Championships Fukuoka, JPN
      1500m Free Sun Yang China 1-Dec-91 14.35.43 18-Nov-10 Asian Games Guangzhou, CHN

      50m Back Xu Jiayu China 19-Aug-95 24.58 13-May-14 Chinese Nationals Qingdao, CHN
      100m Back Xu Jiayu China 19-Aug-95 52.34 12-May-14 Chinese Nationals Qingdao, CHN
      200m Back Xu Jiayu China 19-Aug-95 1.55.11 16-May-14 Chinese Nationals Qingdao, CHN

      50m Breast Johannes Skagius Sweden 10-Feb-95 27.16 30-Jul-13 World Championships Barcelona, ESP
      100m Breast Akihiro Yamaguchi Japan 11-Sep-94 59.56 20-Aug-12 Japan Inter High School Championships Niigata, JPN
      200m Breast Akihiro Yamaguchi Japan 11-Sep-94 2.07.01 15-Sep-12 National Sports Festival of Japan Gifu, JPN

      50m Butterfly Evgeny Sedov Russia 96 23.28 13-May-14 Russian Nationals Moscow, RUS
      100m Butterfly Michael Phelps USA 30-Jun-85 51.10 26-Jul-03 World Championships Barcelona, ESP
      200m Butterfly Michael Phelps USA 30-Jun-85 1.53.93 22-Jul-03 World Championships Barcelona, ESP

      200m Medley Kosuke Hagino Japan 15-Aug-94 1.55.74 13-Apr-13 Japanese National Championships Niigata, JPN
      400m Medley Kosuke Hagino Japan 15-Aug-94 4.07.61 11-Apr-13 Japanese National Championships Niigata, JPN

    • Kirk Nelson says:
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      It’s not arbitary at all. In fact I feel the FINA rule makes it easier. All you need to know is someone’s birth year, not their birth date.

      • aswimfan says:
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        I agree it is easier (for those who try to compile the list), but it is definitely less fair.

      • aswimfan says:
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        Also, for official world record, FINA have to know the exact birthdate, not just the year, so why not using birthdate, instead of just the year?

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